Barbara Walters Doc Director on Icon’s Relationship With Trump, Diane Sawyer Feud

Barbara Walters didn’t set out to become a pioneer for females in media. The legendary broadcast journalist and “The View” creator was simply trying to survive as a woman in a male-dominated industry.

“She’s mentioned in the same sentence as feminist icons, but she wasn’t a crusader. She wasn’t Gloria Steinem,” says Jackie Jesko, the director of “Barbara Walters: Tell Me Everything,” which premieres on Thursday at Tribeca Festival. “She wasn’t doing it for other women. She was doing it for herself.”

That doesn’t make Walters — whose career took off at NBC as the first female co-host of “Today” and shaped history again at “ABC Evening News” as the first female (and highest-paid) network news anchor — any less of a trailblazer.

“We shouldn’t require that of our feminist icons,” the director says. “She made it possible for other women, and she loved that once she realized it, but it wasn’t what drove her. She was upfront about it: ‘I didn’t do it for other women, but I’m so glad that I did it and other women benefited.’”

“Barbara Walters: Tell Me Everything” offers a candid look at the late barrier-breaking journalist, known for asking personal and probing questions of her interview subjects — ranging from Fidel Castro and Saddam Hussein to the Kardashians and Taylor Swift — without flinching. And she went to great lengths, outmaneuvering competitors like Diane Sawyer and Oprah to score the definitive interview with newsmakers of the moment (Monica Lewinsky and the Menendez brothers among them), because she knew she could get the world to tune in and pay attention.

Ahead of the “Tell Me Everything” premiere, Jesko spoke to Variety about those glass ceiling-shattering moments, the icon’s biggest insecurities and why there could only ever be one Barbara Walters.

How Barbara Walters impact the news business?

Barbara was the first female news anchor, so there’s certainly a huge glass ceiling element to it. But beyond her gender, she was the tip of the spear when it came to making entertainment into news. That became a huge movement for television news in the ’80s and ’90s. Other networks saw what she was doing and said, “Barbara’s shows are getting these crazy ratings. We should be like that.”

She was criticized for blurring the line of journalism and entertainment. Is that a fair critique? 

It’s a fair criticism, but at the same time, viewership is what keeps the shows in business. It’s not a state media system, so what people watch dictates how the news is told a lot of the time. You could blame Barbara, but it wouldn’t actually identify the problem.

Was Barbara underestimated as a woman? How did she use that to her advantage?

I feel like that was actually her least-recognized strength. There are different ways to succeed, and one way is to become “one of the guys.” Barbara never did that. She stayed herself. I hesitate to call these things feminine, but she would call up people’s agents and schmooze with them, write letters, send flowers. I don’t know that the male journalists of her ilk of that time were doing things like that.

Then she would ask world leaders about their personal lives, almost like dinner party conversation. It ended up getting some of the most interesting answers. If she had just been challenging them on policy points, they wouldn’t have been anywhere near as revealing or interesting.

How would you describe a Barbara Walters interview?

Barbara wanted to channel what she thought the audience at home would want to know. She was never afraid to ask things or to make observations about people’s answers. Some haven’t aged well, but a lot of it was indicative of public opinion at the time. It was actually quite funny how many times she asked different people, “Are you bisexual? What’s it like to be a homosexual? Tell me about it.” But this was in the late ’70s, so asking what it’s like to be gay was actually a revolutionary thing to be talking about on network news. There’s been a lot of resurgence of Barbara’s clips, and people say, “She’s being so mean.” Some of it is being put in the context of today, when that’s not really a fair way to look at it.

How did Barbara convince people to do interviews when they knew she was going to ask tough questions?

There was no social media at the time. If you wanted public exposure, you had to submit yourself to someone like Barbara Walters. Especially in the ’80s and ’90s, being interviewed by Barbara was a status symbol because she was so important and got these enormous audiences. It was almost a seal of approval that you got asked to sit for a Barbara Walters interview.

How would the social media era, where anyone can give interviews or post statements anywhere at any time, have impacted her career?

It would be entirely different. There couldn’t be a Barbara Walters in the same way again today, and that’s because there were only a few options for information media. So you would get 70 million people watching the Monica Lewinsky interview at the same time, and then talking about it the next day, week, month. That’s not an environment that exists anymore. Now, even if you have a YouTuber or a podcaster who gets big numbers, you’re not listening at the same time, so there’s less of consensus media.

How did she get people to open up during interviews?

She always did her homework. She would often impress the subject with how much she knew about them. She would dig up old stuff, like, “I see your high school yearbook.” She was also very disarming. Oftentimes she would preface her questions with, “You know I have to ask you this…” She was good at making people feel seen and comfortable.

She described feeling like she had to fight for every professional opportunity. How did that shape her?

She was a fierce warrior, and she had to be, because she was knocked down so many times. All the way back to NBC, the male anchors were like, “I don’t want her asking questions.” So she ended up going out in the field and pioneering field reporting, which became her whole brand. She knew nobody was going to protect her, nobody was looking out for her, and so she was her own fierce advocate.

You interviewed Oprah, Disney CEO Bob Iger, Monica Lewinsky and others. How did their input shape the film?

We wanted people who had different insights into Barbara Walters. She and Oprah had a very real relationship; there was a mentor, mentee situation. Then there’s Monica, who could speak to what it was like to be on the other side of the chair. I was curious to hear what her experience was like since it’s probably the most famous thing Barbara ever did.

Did you try to talk to Diane Sawyer?

I feel like Diane’s perspective is as well represented as we could have had it.

What did you make of their feud?

I thought it was extremely revealing about Barbara. It’s clear in the way she talks about herself — like calling herself ugly — that she was a very insecure person. Her issue was that Diane represented everything she wasn’t, or, her deepest insecurities. Diane is incredibly talented and accomplished. But she’s beautiful, blonde, tall and all these things that Barbara wished she was. It sounds silly, but they are things that Barbara had a hard time dealing with.

What was her relationship like with Donald Trump?

They knew each other. They ran in some of the same New York circles for years. She did this really good interview with him in 1991 where she calls him out for his bankruptcies. He does the same shuck and jive that he continues to do today about how the media is unfair to him and blah, blah, blah. But she doesn’t let him get away with it. I think if she interviewed him now, she would hold him to task.

How did “The View” change the public’s perception of her?

“The View” was important to Barbara, and I think the thing she was most proud of. Prior to that, she was an instrument of the audience. She was a journalist, so you didn’t always know where she stood or what she thought. On “The View,” it took a while, but she eventually started to loosen up and be more of herself. That was exciting to her to come out of her shell a little bit.

Did you ever get to meet Barbara Walters?

We never met. I did work at ABC, but I started as a peon and she was Barbara Walters. We did have a phone call once. I worked for an important person, and I would answer the phones. One day, I saw her name come up on the caller ID. This happened all the time; it would say Christiane Amanpour, Diane Sawyer or whoever, but it was usually their assistant. So I pick it up and said, “This is Jackie!” On the other end of the line, it’s Barbara, and she’s like, “Jackie! That’s my daughter’s name.” That was our entire conversation.

As a filmmaker, it more intimidating to make a film about someone who is living or dead?

It depends on the person. I don’t think this would have been possible to do if Barbara was still alive because she would have wanted to direct it.